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User:Kendra Brown/Latin Lew/95v

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Munich 95v / PDF page 36

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Missing Zettel verse from Dresden 108v (PDF page 54)

Page scan

German

Das abschneyden

  1. Schneid ab die • herten
  2. von vnnden In baiden geferten

English

The slicing off

  1. Slice off the hard ones
  2. from below in both paths/routes.

95v a

95v a Latin

  1. HABITUS ABSCISIONIS.
  3. HIC habitus removet superintorsiones ensis tui,
  4. atque eum ita tractes necesse est.
  5. Si contra hostem Athleticam exerceas ex inferis ictibus,
  6. vel si te in custodiam composueris,
  7. quae nobis Populus dicitur,
  8. et is ensem suum tuo superimponat priusquam ensem attollas,
  9. ensis tuus inferné remaneat sub ipsius gladio,
  10. verum acie brevi firmiter si sustuleris,
  11. et si is suppreßerit,
  12. tum retrorsum atque furtim ab ipsius ense tuo remoto,
  13. celeriter iuxta ensem hostis superné faciem sauciato.

Notes on streichen: Grimm, vol 19, col. 1228 2 b) streichen als ausdruck der fortbewegung fast jeder tierart. auch hier oft für den raschen lauf der tiere, γ) fliegen; anfangs 'sich rasch fliegend fortbewegen': explosive movement of animals 2) b) auf etwas aus sein und verstohlen oder forschend umherstreifen c) sich fortbewegen, streifen, mit dem nebensinn des lautlosen und zuweilen geisterhaften Grimm vol. 19, col 1193 2) b) sich (heimlich) davonmachen, sich verziehen, auch ausreiszen d) vereinzelt zur bezeichnung nicht optisch wahrnehmbarer erscheinungen; für einen akustischen vorgang

Also, this has to be carried out stealthily in order for it to work.

95v a English

  1. Gesture of slicing off
  2. This gesture shifts the upper wrappings of your sword,
  3. and it is necessary to handle it thusly.
  4. If you employ Athletics against the enemy using the strike from below,
  5. or if you arrange yourself in the guard,
  6. which is called Popular/Poplar by us,
  7. and HE places his sword over yours before you lift up the sword[^1],
  8. your sword remains in contact below under his sword,
  9. truly, if you will strongly raise using the short edge,
  10. and if HE presses down,
  11. then your sword having been shifted backwards and stealthily away from his,
  12. quickly wound the face abovely next to the opponent's sword.

95v a smoothed English

  • Gesture of slicing off
  • This gesture shifts the upper wrappings of your sword, and it is necessary to handle it thusly.
  • Either athletically use the strike from below against the enemy, or arrange yourself in the guard we call Popular/Poplar.
  • If HE places his sword over yours before you lift it, stay under and in contact with his sword, then strongly raise up using the short edge, and when HE presses down, shift your sword stealthily/sneakily back away from his, and quickly wound the face above next to the opponent's sword.

95v a notes

  • [^1]: according to DMLBS, "gladius" has senses of "symbol of authority or rank" that are absent in "ensis," but we're not sure how to indicate two different terms for "sword" here.

should we have abscisio and incisio match better in english?

  • DMLBS supports it
  • abscisio/abscissio seems not to be a very common word
  • both have a sort of awkward too-technical sense about them
  • abschneiden is not like that in German; further, there's no "inschneiden"-- "incisio" is the pair for "schnitt"

what's the difference between all these sword actions anyway?

  • schnitt/slice/incisio -> draw cut, like cutting a tomato?
  • hauw/blow/ictus/ferire ->

"furtim" is unique to the Latin-- German has nothing about "like a thief" or "stealthily" or "without detection." Did the Latin writer think that "move your sword like a stealthy thief" was a clear description without context? or that it clarified the German usefully?

  • is the movement "stealthy" because you need to escape contact with the opponent's sword without them realizing and reacting to it?
    • aha: to do this without being noticed, you have to do it explosively like a startled bird (which is a sense of streychen in Grimm-- what the word means when applied to animals), more than subtly like a silent thief.
    • it can also mean "animals moving unseen" as in "at night while people are sleeping"
  • so the German does have a sense of "unseen" and potentially "infiltrating" and simultaneously a sense of "sudden, startling" that Latin isn't able to capture in a single term
  • does it mean something that the Latin writer chose to only capture one sense from the German?

95v b

95v b Latin

  1. ALIA EFFIGIES
  2. QUUM versus hostem in congreßu inferis ictibus uteris,
  3. vel in custodia Populi consistas,
  4. et is ensem tuum feriat prope capulum ita,
  5. ut mucro eius vergat in latus dextrum,
  6. tum celeriter nodo sublato super ipsius gladium,
  7. acie longa premißa caput hostis vulneres,
  8. vel si is ensem tuum ex latere sinistro feriat,
  9. sublato rursus nodo supra ensem adversarij celerrimé,
  10. acie brevi caput eius concutito[^2].

95v b English

  1. ANOTHER FORM
  2. Which you will use together with the strike from below toward the enemy in the approach,
  3. or while you stand in the guard Popular/Poplar,
  4. and HE strikes your sword thus near the hilt,
  5. in order to incline the point into the right side,
  6. then quickly lift the pommel over his sword[^3],
  7. you injure the head of the opponent (the long edge having been sent forward).
  8. or if he strikes your sword from the left side,
  9. More quickly lift the sword of the enemy above [and] backwards using the pommel,[^4]
  10. you will shake his head violently using the short edge.

95v b notes

  • [^2]: to hit two things together, to strike one thing upon another. to shake violently, to harass, agitate, threaten
  • [^3]: gladius again
  • Note that Latin has "congressu" here even though the German doesn't have zufechten
  • [^4]: the german uses the same phrase for both mentions of the pommel (i think)-- the latin uses it very differently the second time

Missing Zettel verse from Dresden 108v (PDF page 54)

Page image

German

  1. Vier seinn der schnit
  2. zwen vnden zwen oben mit

English (Garber?)

  1. There are four slices:
  2. Two above and two below.

95v c

95v c Latin

  1. DE QUATUOR INCISIONIBUS
  2. DUAE sunt supernae,
  3. quae usurpantur contra Athletas,
  4. qui digladiantur ex permunitionibus,
  5. vel collisionibus ensium,
  6. solentque ferire contra latus alterum,
  7. quod incisione hoc modo prohibere poteris.
  8. Si adversarius exceptione,
  9. vel aliâs ensis coniunctione ex latere sinistro,
  10. atque subitò transversario vel alio ictu dextrum latus ferire conetur,
  11. tum ictum vitabundus sinistro pede in latus adversarij dextrum prosilias,
  12. et aciem ensis longam,
  13. brachijs adversarij utrisque superimponas,
  14. incîdendoque reprimas,
  15. et eo habitu utrinque utêris,
  16. quoties ex permutatione alterum latus appetierit.

95v c English

  1. Regarding the four slices
  2. Two are above,
  3. which are used against Athletes,
  4. who flourish the sword from fortifications,
  5. or from collisions of the swords,
  6. and they are in the habit of striking (a bargain) against the other side,
  7. you will be able to prevent that in this way using the slice.
  8. If the adversary were to attempt to strike[^5] using a singling-out,
  9. or in a conjunction of the other sword from the left side,
  10. and with a sudden transverse or if he were to attempt to strike the right side using another strike,
  11. then you, taking evasive action with respect to the strike, would jump with the left foot into the right side of the adversary,
  12. and you place the long point of the sword on top
  13. above both arms of the adversary,
  14. and you would press back using a slice,
  15. and you use this gesture from both sides,
  16. as often as he assails the other side from the exchange.


95v c notes

  • 12-13: weird phrase split
  • parallel construction, two ways the opponent attacks you, present in german
  • The shift in teaching style starts here-- the change to numbers of variations of things, and exercises with lots of variations
  • [^5]: repeated from line 10 to make the grammar work in english
  • The latin renderings for versatzung and versetzen are not very consistent: 2 remota, 3 exceperit, 1 excipient, removeo, retractio, defenderit ... excipiendo, retractio, repellitur, impetus retardantur,

it seems like the german is treating this concept with a single term, consistently, while the Latin has this whole cluster of words that don't align to a single meaning (remove, take out, repel are the most common, but they're pretty distinct from each other). there's no obvious pattern (eg one term for if you're doing it, one for he)

    • final count:
    • 12 excipi*
    • 7 remo*
    • 5 repel*
    • 1 defenderit ictus excipiendo
    • 2 retractio (from the TOC but nowhere else)


95v d

95v d Latin

  1. Inferiores duae incisiones exerceantur contra gladiatores sublatis brachijs incurrentes :
  2. ijs igitur hac ratione utitor,
  3. quoties adversarius ensem tuum ex primo congressu feriat,
  4. brachique sustulerit,
  5. atque sinistro latere incurrat,
  6. ensem tuum commutabis ita,
  7. ut pollex substet,[^6]
  8. acies longa itidem capulo ensis hostilis[^7] substet,
  9. pertingat autem brachium ipsius,
  10. ex ea forma incîdendo sursum tendas,
  11. vel si incurrat,
  12. brachijs levatis versus latus dextrum tuum,
  13. rursum ita ensem mutato ut pollex substet,[^8]
  14. acies brevis itidem capulo adversarij substituatur,
  15. brachium contingens, atque sursum si tollas,
  16. rite usus fueris ijs habitibus.


95v d English

  1. The two lower cutting-intos are practiced against gladiators running in arms lifted:
  2. during this therefore use this method,
  3. as often as the adversary strikes your sword out of the first approach,
  4. and he has lifted the arm,
  5. and he runs in to the left side,
  6. you will change your sword so,
  7. that the thumb stands below,
  8. the long edge in the same way stands below the hilt of the sword of the enemy,
  9. it would reach as far as his other arm,
  10. out of this form you should stretch toward (him) using a high cutting-in,
  11. or if he runs in,
  12. the arms having been raised up against your right side,
  13. alter shift the sword backward so that the thumb stands below,
  14. the short edge is in the same way placed below with respect to the hilt of the adversary,
  15. touching the arm, and if you lift up,
  16. duly use this condition.


95v d notes

  • [^6]: 6-7: weird extra commas
  • [^7]: hostilis instead of hostis-- enemy instead of opponent
  • [^8]: previously, we rendered this as "the thumb causes [it] to stop"
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