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Difference between revisions of "Jörg Wilhalm/Image comparison"
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! id="thin" | <p>{{rating|C|Draft Translation}}<br/>by [[User:Stephen Cheney|Stephen Cheney]]</p> | ! id="thin" | <p>{{rating|C|Draft Translation}}<br/>by [[User:Stephen Cheney|Stephen Cheney]]</p> | ||
− | ! <p>[[ | + | ! <p>[[Wilhalm/Sollinger Fechtbuch (Cod.I.6.2º.2)|Archetype]] (1523)</p> |
− | ! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cgm 3711)|Munich Version I]] (1523) | + | ! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cgm 3711)|Munich Version I]] (1523)</p> |
− | ! <p>[[Gregor Erhart Fechtbuch (MS E.1939.65.354)|Glasgow Version]] (1533) | + | ! <p>[[Gregor Erhart Fechtbuch (MS E.1939.65.354)|Glasgow Version]] (1533)</p> |
− | ! <p>[[Maister Liechtenawers Kunstbuech (Cgm 3712)|Munich Version II]] (1556) | + | ! <p>[[Maister Liechtenawers Kunstbuech (Cgm 3712)|Munich Version II]] (1556)</p> |
− | ! <p>[[Künnst zu fechten vonn dem Lienhartt Sollinger (Cod.Guelf.38.21 Aug.2º)|Wolfenbüttel Version I]] (1588) | + | ! <p>[[Künnst zu fechten vonn dem Lienhartt Sollinger (Cod.Guelf.38.21 Aug.2º)|Wolfenbüttel Version I]] (1588)</p> |
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|- style="vertical-align:top;" | |- style="vertical-align:top;" | ||
! id="thin" | <p>{{rating|start}}<br/>by [[Ondřej Vodička]] and [[Michael Chidester]]</p> | ! id="thin" | <p>{{rating|start}}<br/>by [[Ondřej Vodička]] and [[Michael Chidester]]</p> | ||
! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cod.I.6.4º.5)|Draftbook]] (1522) </p> | ! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cod.I.6.4º.5)|Draftbook]] (1522) </p> | ||
+ | ! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cgm 3711)|Munich Version I]] (1523) </p> | ||
! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cod.I.6.2º.3)|Archetype]] (1522) </p> | ! <p>[[Jörg Wilhalm Hutters kunst zu Augspurg (Cod.I.6.2º.3)|Archetype]] (1522) </p> | ||
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! <p>[[Maister Liechtenawers Kunstbuech (Cgm 3712)|Munich Version II]] (1556) </p> | ! <p>[[Maister Liechtenawers Kunstbuech (Cgm 3712)|Munich Version II]] (1556) </p> | ||
! <p>[[Confectbuch von Abrichtung vollständiges Turnierbuch (Cod.Guelf.1.6.3 Aug.2º)|Wolfenbüttel Version II]] (ca. 1600) </p> | ! <p>[[Confectbuch von Abrichtung vollständiges Turnierbuch (Cod.Guelf.1.6.3 Aug.2º)|Wolfenbüttel Version II]] (ca. 1600) </p> | ||
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<p>If the weak man has art and knowledge, he may use them rightly<ref>With a good intention/forethought</ref> and thus he may obtain great honor and possession.</p> | <p>If the weak man has art and knowledge, he may use them rightly<ref>With a good intention/forethought</ref> and thus he may obtain great honor and possession.</p> | ||
| [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 Ir.jpg|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 Ir.jpg|600px|center]] | ||
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| <p>[2] Help [me], Lord, thou Eternal Word; help [the body] here, the soul there.<ref>The statement as given in the treatises of [[Paulus Kal]] and [[Hans Talhoffer]] is "God, thou Eternal Word, help the body here, the soul there". See [[Page:MS 1825 05v.jpg|MS 1825, fol. 5v]], [[Page:MS Chart.A.558 002r.png|MS Chart.A.558, fol. 2r]], and [[Page:Ms.XIX.17-3 02r.png|Ms.XIX.17-3, fol. 2r]].</ref></p> | | <p>[2] Help [me], Lord, thou Eternal Word; help [the body] here, the soul there.<ref>The statement as given in the treatises of [[Paulus Kal]] and [[Hans Talhoffer]] is "God, thou Eternal Word, help the body here, the soul there". See [[Page:MS 1825 05v.jpg|MS 1825, fol. 5v]], [[Page:MS Chart.A.558 002r.png|MS Chart.A.558, fol. 2r]], and [[Page:Ms.XIX.17-3 02r.png|Ms.XIX.17-3, fol. 2r]].</ref></p> | ||
| [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 Iv.jpg|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 Iv.jpg|600px|center]] | ||
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| <p>[3] Here the master introduces his lord into the list, and thus should he hold himself.</p> | | <p>[3] Here the master introduces his lord into the list, and thus should he hold himself.</p> | ||
| [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 IIr.jpg|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cod.I.6.4º.5 IIr.jpg|600px|center]] | ||
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| [[File:Cod.I.6.2º.3 01r.png|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cod.I.6.2º.3 01r.png|600px|center]] | ||
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| [[File:Cgm 3712 168r.jpg|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cgm 3712 168r.jpg|600px|center]] | ||
| [[File:Cod.Guelf.1.6.3 Aug.2º 089r.png|600px|center]] | | [[File:Cod.Guelf.1.6.3 Aug.2º 089r.png|600px|center]] | ||
|} | |} | ||
− | + | </div> | |
== References == | == References == | ||
{{reflist}} | {{reflist}} |
Latest revision as of 19:40, 18 April 2022
Archetype (1523) |
Munich Version I (1523) |
Glasgow Version (1533) |
Munich Version II (1556) |
Wolfenbüttel Version I (1588) | |
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[2] Whoever wants to hew upon you,
If you want to behold the art, hereafter what you strike crisply on. |
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[3] The two both stand on the left in the over hew Don’t fence above on the left if you are right handed, |
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[4] He stands in the over hew
This is about the wrath hew. Whoever hews you from above, take the wrath hew strong on your shoulder and hew in straight, over the parry, and hang and wind with the sword as if you want to thwart, and allow to drop to both sides with half failers and hit him with the long edge to the right ear to the head away. |
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[5] He stands in the over hew
This is the wrath hew on the left side, and take the same from the left shoulder and hew him quickly in long to the head and hang and wind with it, and again use the failers, and hit yet again as stands written before and behind. |
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[6] This is the wrath point
This is the direction, and note: whoever hews you from above, and take it with half failers, but hit in as before and behind. |
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[7] He stands in the over hew
This is the other wrath point on the other side, take it also thusly: If they indeed both wrath hew from the shoulder, and one must make a stab from a hew, and the hew must be thrown, and take that also quickly away like the above. |
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[8] Here, fences to the war
This is the direction about the war: Whoever’s war aims above, Gloss note. |
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[9] This play is in the war This is also about the war, and should also know that in all windings, because there are very many breaks about them and also to them, realize how one bares with the war. Gloss note. |
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[10] This is an outer winding and break from the war This is another play from the war and a break of the previous play, and is an outer winding that goes: hew or stab, find slices well. You shall also |
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[11] This is also about the war This is also about the war: squint to the point You shall also turn crooked and search to and on and test his techniques, whether he is soft or hard in his technique. Gloss note. |
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[12] This is also about the war This is about the war. The direction: Whoever rightly fights one with the sword near the neck, he must turn with a winding through and wind again. That goes well weak and strong below and turn your sword at the neck and jerk the left foot behind you and slice him or the neck. Gloss note. |
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[13] Those are points in the war Those are the false points in the war. They go forth earnestly, because why they pertain to many passages, in addition, windings below through or wind nimbly above to the top and throw the point onto the hands and invert forcing run through also if you want to wrestle. |
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[14] This is also about the war This is the war when you strike someone to the right side, then the other takes the war and needs no more from you than to parry your opening with the long edge and thus he shoots to you with the sword above over, and do as you see it pictured. |
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[15] This is also about the war, a sword taking Gloss note: This is a sword taking and goes from the war, which one takes very slightly away, so that there are yet very many good plays which pertain to the war, and is many things of the war, and therefore you should note very many things. |
Page:Cod.Guelf.38.21 Aug.2º|021v.jpg|600px|center]] | ||||
[16] Here, fencing to the four openings
Here fence to the openings to the head and also to the side. Know to aim for the four openings, Also, it comes after at the end hereafter how you shall break the four openings. Gloss note. |
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[17] Those are also two openings Those are the other two openings to the other side, therefore deceive and note on as the whole, and whoever takes the openings below, they will be shamed above near the ears. Gloss note weak and strong. |
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[18] This is the crooked hew on the right side change
This is about the crooked hew, the direction: Crook on nimbly, or use if you want to wrestle, and step to him in the triangle. Gloss note. |
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[19] He stands in the over hew
That is, crook on nimbly. Whoever parries well |
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[20] This is how one shall break in the four openings: He hits him with opening to the side, thus the other breaks it to him and hits him behind onto his head
This is to break openings, and you want to reckon yourself, That I have heard. Gloss note. |
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[21] There this breaks the opening on the other side, and is also to break the openings
This is the opening breaking on the other side, and break it as you see pictured. You must also double above, and mutate correctly below. Item: The opening breaking shall stand pictured in front before the crooked hew. |
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[22] The guard from the day
Note: These are two guards, and this is the guard from the day. He has his sword raised upwards, and the other has his sword raised downwards beside the left foot. This is the fool and is also called the iron gate. Then there are four guards. Ox and plow, those are also two guards. Gloss note. |
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[23] Skull hew
Item: This is about the crown, etc. and then he raises the sword upwards. He stands in the skull hew, and the other in a position, and when he hits away from the roof, thus the other takes the crown all right. Gloss note. |
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[24] This is the thwart hew
This is the thwart, it takes and whoever directs the failer on from below two times aims as he wishes. Gloss note. |
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[25] This is the thwart on the other side
This is the thwart on the other side, take it also as on the other side: invert, force, run through, and also wrestle, and in the elbows in the scale and step to the left, and don’t be lazy. You may wrestle in both thwarts. Gloss note. |
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[26] He breaks the thwart
This is the play of how one shall break the thwart: One thwart breaks there, the other with placing upon and with shooting under and with shooting over. You may take the two hangings from it if you want, then they are two hangings, which is very strict for the man. Gloss note. |
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[27] He stands in the guard from day and raises as much as he likes
This is also a play from the thwart: Whatever thwarts itself well moves to the head with jumping from one side to the other, is also one that is better than that, therefore hear. Gloss note. |
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[28] He lies in the thwart and has taken it with a jump, and shoves his arm away from him This is also about the thwart: One takes that also with a jump, take that as you see it pictured, thereafter comes the break, therefore it itself is then not a play for you, it has a break. Therefore note art, hear it beautifully. |
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[29] He also stands in the thwart, and he wants to shove away
This is the break against it: You may well quickly take a slice, and away from there so that he may not reach you, then one play breaks the other, and note as well what is good for you. |
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[30] That is also driven from the thwart with jumping to the head, how he bares with his turn without fear This is also a play: whatever well thwarts itself driving with jumping to the head, and a slice, a stab and ignore and fence at the neck, therefore understand it as you see pictured above. Gloss note. |
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[31] This is the thwart in above, also a play This is yet again about the thwart from the above, so that you then understand it, that very many come from the thwart, if one searches for it, because it is good to make to all things weak and strong. Gloss note. |
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[32] This is the ox
This is about the ox and plow, the direction: The thing and the second thing are an origin of all art. Ox and pflug are justifiably hard in the war, in all things, with which to make the old slice. Thus you are secure in all things and it may not fail you. |
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[33] This is the ox
This is the other ox and plow and are also justifiably hard in the war. Item: One shall drive the ox and plow from both sides, then they have four windings and four points which you may use as you wish, because they are also two guards. Gloss note. |
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[34] He stands armed[1] This is also about the squinter and has his neck, thus the other takes an armored play and breaks his play, as you see it pictured. This is also a play, a break. Gloss note. |
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[35] This is also about the squinter, play and break, and there he has the sword on the neck. This is the break and the other the play. Note that as you see it pictured. |
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[36] This is again about the squinter, the break, the run over, that strongly breaks his squinter, hit or slice and away from there quickly and soon, and therefore is not a play, it is a break from it. Gloss note. |
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[37] This is another play from the squinter. Squint to the point and take the neck without apprehension, and at the same time so note and learn art that you yourself have become accustomed to. Gloss note. |
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[38] He stands hitting in the above parry
The squinter breaks in |
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[39] He stands hitting in the above parry
The squinter In all things, let us make crisply. |
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[40] That is a squint to the point and take the neck without apprehension, and in addition strong into the scale
This is from the squinter. Squint to the point and take the neck without apprehension, and stand into the scales and hold solidly to yourself, and if you want to go away from him, then wind out and away from him. Gloss note. |
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[41] He hits above over
This is also from the squinter, and is a break from it, as you see it pictured, and realize that still more plays are which break it, and realize precisely how he bares. Gloss note. |
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[42] This is the skull hew
This is about the skull hew, the direction: This is squinter with skuller, the face is threatened. With its turn, the chest quickly threatened, and what comes from him, the crown, all right. Gloss note. |
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[43] This is the short edge
This is also about the skull hew. It is to know that one shall take the skull hew with three steps and one may take it with a step, then the crown comes from him, that takes away the slice through the crown. Thus you break it hard and beautiful. Press the sweep, withdraw it with slicing. Gloss note. |
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[44] This is a parry
This is about the four positions, and also always a position and a parry from it. The four positions alone, |
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[45] This is also about the positions and is to know that one position breaks the other, and those are two positions, one lies over, the other under. Therefore note this, and hear that the lowest may well go through the above, and went onto his head, and therefore penetrates. Do well, so I shall say it. Gloss note. |
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[46] This is also about the positions, so that he then shoots on crooked on the position, and shoots to the top of his sword, and is the shooting over, also a position the other breaks. Gloss note. |
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[47] This is a parry
This is about the four parries, it hurts you, and be crisp and come before. If you have heard, he may come to no art. Gloss note. |
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[48] This is again about the four positions, and the parry upon it and shooting over. Those are also positions, note that there below with the strong and long into the scale, and if he wants to execute against you, then you may take a slice if you want to, or may hang, whatever fences best to you. Gloss note. |
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[49] This is again about the four positions, and from the parry, there note on and watch: those are also two positions, and that is also a position, the shooting-over has, and the positions have an end, and the four parries, they are all side by side, then it is many that it searches. Gloss note. |
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[50] This is about the pursuit. and have eight. Gloss note. |
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[51] This is another pursuit. You should take the pursuit on both sides, step long if you want to stride, because the pursuit is several things, and that is the pursuit when one has hit you and wants to go from you or withdraw, then follow after him and defend yourself. Gloss note. |
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[52] This is about the run over, there note that the run-over is thus: one runs over the other outside with the pommel outward with force, and that is an outer run over, and it is still more, and therefore when one wants to run over you, so raise your sword strong in the height, so he can not run-over you. |
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[53] This is also about the run over, and that is an inward run over, and whoever aims below, as you wish. Gloss mark. |
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[54] This is also a run-over, and is armored, and a wrestling goes with it, and therefore note precisely on when he wants to throw him over the left foot and many pertain to the run over, if one wishes to search. Gloss note as it stands precisely pictured. |
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[55] This is also a run over with the pommel, and a run over armored with wrestling as before, and back him and throw him with it and do as stands pictured above. Gloss note, therefore the runs over. |
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[56] This is about the set aside. Whoever hews away at you from roof, set his hew away with the sword with the short edge. If he is soft, then let your pommel go around and hit him with the thwart. But if he is hard, then don’t hit and take and turn him at his sword and work. Gloss note as it stands pictured below. |
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[57] A set aside This is a set-aside on the other side and one takes that also with the short edge like before, and note on the weak and strong, whether he is soft or hard. Gloss note. |
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[58] A set aside
This is about the set aside. Hew, stab, quickly injure, and the man behind lies in the long point, and the man in front sets him aside with a set-aside. |
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[59] A set aside
This is another set aside, and the man in front sets the point of the other aside. Gloss note. |
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[60] A set aside
This is whoever wants to set-aside, That is also as a set aside. Gloss note. |
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[61] A set aside
This is whoever wants to set aside, hew, stab, crooked, quickly injure, and is also a set aside. Gloss note, as it stands pictured below. |
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[62] This is the first upper slice to the top of the arms and slice away the hardening fast and quickly with your technique and have eight and take the slice with force, and therefore to do, gloss note, as it stands pictured below. |
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[63] This is the second upper slice, take it also with the long edge. Gloss note. |
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[64] This is about the lower slice, the third, there slice away the hardening through both arms. Note that as it stands pictured above, and take that fast and soon away from there. Gloss note. |
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[65] This is the fourth slice. Take it also as you see in the picture below, and take him strong or soft as you want, and quickly away from there soon, and nimbly so that your slice completes to you. Gloss note. |
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[66] This is also an upper slice. Take it as you see it pictured above, and slice him away the hardening fast and quickly and away from there so that he does not follow you with the pursuit. Gloss note. |
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[67] Item: This is the old slice. The man in front drives it, take it thusly, and pull on him below through the right arm strong and long upwards and quickly away from there. Gloss note. |
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[68] This is the other old slice to the other side. Take it thusly as it stands pictured above, and take it up quickly and behind away from there, so that he does not reach you. Gloss note. |
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[69] This is about the hand press. The sword presses into the hands, and do this nimbly: turn your sword to flat through the hands. Gloss note. |
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[70] This is also a hand press. Take it thusly, and note: Take your sword and hit him to the opening and press him from you strong. Gloss note thereon, and realize it how he bares. |
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[71] This is about the hanging. Two hangings turn out of one hand from the other in all techniques, hew, stab, position, soft or hard with your technique, that is the hanging, which thwarts itself as you see it pictured above. Gloss note, that is a hanging on the one side, understand that precisely. |
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[72] Item: This is another hanging on the other side. He does it with the short sword and raises the point that faces downward, as you see it pictured above, and are the two hangings, two good parries to all things. Gloss note. |
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[73] The broken window Item: This is the speaking window, break and joyfully make the stance, and inspect his play. Your thwart with the strong and wind through to him from below and note as you see it pictured above. Gloss note. |
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[74] A long point This is about the four false points, and is the first, a long point, and they go to both sides. There note that the long point goes to his face, and is good to all things, to make a war with it. Gloss note as you find it pictured precisely. |
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[75] This is the second secret point, take that as you see it pictured above, it also goes to the face. Therefore note on and search for what is good from it. |
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[76] This is the third secret point, and is a false point. Note it as it stands pictured above. You may also take the going-through or change through as you want. Take the going-through thusly: go through to him with the point below. Gloss note. |
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[77] This is the fourth false point. Take it thusly as you see it pictured above, and he gets the sword through to him from the hand, and is also a good point and realize and note on it, as you see it pictured above. |
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[78] This is again a false point, and a false step. Take it as you see it pictured above, and when he falls onto your sword, wind on with your sword, thus you stand in the long parry. Gloss note. |
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[79] He stands in the unicorn This is a false point and goes from the speaking window, and take it as you see it pictured above, and is the unicorn. Gloss note. |
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[80] Item: This is the crown. He holds his sword armed in the hand nicely, and realize it already with the crown, it is good in all scales, to all defenses, and be strong in it or weak as you want. Gloss note. |
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[81] This is the slice through the crown, and take that all right as you see it pictured, in all things, if you want to make a slice. Gloss note nicely on the slice in the crown. |
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[82] Item: This is the break onto the crown, there note all right as you see it pictured, and he raises sword upwards, it breaks the crown with the grasping at the sword with the cross, look upon it, because he wrenches the crown away to him. Gloss note. Here the long recital has an end, and that god help us nimbly, and the crown is the very last, and is the very best. |
Incomplete Translation |
Draftbook (1522) |
Munich Version I (1523) |
Archetype (1522) |
Munich Version II (1556) |
Wolfenbüttel Version II (ca. 1600) |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
[1] Here stand three persons, one rich, one strong, one weak. If the rich man has neither art nor knowledge, he wastes his possessions and belongings and has nothing left. If the strong man has neither art nor courage, he gains neither possessions nor belongings. What good is his strength to him then? If the weak man has art and knowledge, he may use them rightly[2] and thus he may obtain great honor and possession. |
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[2] Help [me], Lord, thou Eternal Word; help [the body] here, the soul there.[3] |
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[3] Here the master introduces his lord into the list, and thus should he hold himself. |
References
- ↑ Meaning as though armored
- ↑ With a good intention/forethought
- ↑ The statement as given in the treatises of Paulus Kal and Hans Talhoffer is "God, thou Eternal Word, help the body here, the soul there". See MS 1825, fol. 5v, MS Chart.A.558, fol. 2r, and Ms.XIX.17-3, fol. 2r.